Help with a chameleon based race

[pnwrunner]

I am working on a game heavily inspired by Dark Sun (2nd Ed D&D) but leaning more into the Sword and Sorcery/weird fantasy angle. I want to dump the Thri-kreen ( too alien, to high a point build to feel authentic). I think there is room for a migrant Hunter culture and think a Chameleon based build would suit the setting. My initial ideas are camouflage and independent eyes. Maybe a bonus to toughness and water retention? What hindrances strike you as fitting?

[SteelDraco]

Aw man, I love thri-kreen. :-(

There's certainly precedent for some lizard-people on Dark Sun - I think there are a couple of humanoid races like that already, though I don't remember a chameleon one.

Build-wise I'd probably call it just a static Stealth bonus; something like +2 to Stealth rolls outside of combat so they're not using it for in-combat stuff like Stealth Tests and disappearing in a fight.

I'm not sure what I would do with independent eyes as a mechanic, if anything. Seems pretty minor to me.

Toughness (probably Armor) works fine for scales, and a bonus to surviving in the desert/needing less water is extremely common for Dark Sun races just 'cause of how harsh the setting can be.

Hindrances... hm. Maybe something to do with having trouble in cold environments, so they prefer to be active during the day when the sun's out? Dark Sun's not a very technological setting so All Thumbs should be out, and Outsider is pretty boring IMO for a race.

[ValhallaGH]

For a Chameleon race, I'm thinking chromatic-skin control, some climbing ability (chameleons are great in trees but not deserts, unlike iguanas), and maybe the creepy rolling eyeballs.

Mechanically, that would probably be a Skill Bonus (Stealth) of +1 (or +2 if they can mimic textures too, looking like striated rock faces and not just a pile of sand) when they are mostly uncovered (chromatic skin does nothing for your clothing), Wall Walker for climbing impossibly well, and maybe Skill (Notice) for the eyes giving them an easier time focusing in multiple directions.

Drawbacks depend upon what you want your race balance to be. For a +4 balance, you wouldn't need to add any drawbacks at all; for a +0 balance you would need three or four points of drawbacks.

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Thri Kreen are totally over powering but a fun thought experiment.
Leaper because they jump good, Additional Action for the extra pair of arms, a level of Armor because of their chitinous outer layer, and maybe Environmental Resistance (Heat) because they are supposed to operate in the open desert frequently. Add in some Bite and Claws natural weapons and a Poisonous Touch (Paralyzing) bite and you get most of their terrifying ability.
That would be +13 benefit, so we are looking for nine or eleven points of drawbacks. Most of those are going to be social, like Bloodthirsty (kill prisoners and fallen foes) and Racial Enemy, but Big would work because of their distinctive morphology. Depending upon how you view their isolation, they might have a Reduced Core Skill for Common Knowledge or Persuasion.
I am choosing to ignore attributes, darkvision, and psionics. The first two because every monster race was "physically superior to humans and able to see in the dark" (to the point that human-level body and senses should have been a racial deficit in the old D&D rules) and the latter because each individual can just take Arcane Background (Psionics) and the Skill instead of relying on free stuff.

[pnwrunner]

I wrote this up years ago so the math may no longer work and by the end of it I felt like it was too much...

Thri-Kreen

+2 Exoskeleton: Thri-Kreen begin with 2 points of armor.

+2 Agile: Thri-Kreen begin with a D6 in Agility rather than a D4.

+1 Swift: Thri-kreen have a base pace of 8

+1 Tireless: The Kreen do not sleep and are confused when their humanoid companions slumber. Thri-Kreen may engage in normal activity around the clock, assuming they have enough food and water. Normal exhaustion rules apply during intense activity and the Kreen must rest to be able to heal their injuries.

+2 Multi Limbed: Thri Kreen come equipped from the egg with a devastating offensive capability, four clawed “hands” and a bite with which they are considered to be ambidextrous with each. Kreen without the appropriate edges still suffer from MAP. Each “limb” inflicts Strength+D4 in damage.

+2 Leap: Kreen may leap, as part of their movement, 20 feet (3 squares) upwards or 50 feet (9 squares forward). If this is part of an attack it is always considered a “Wild Attack”.



-4 Unusual Physiology: Thri-Kreen make no use of armor and, in fact, cannot wear armor or other items intended to be worn by humanoids besides satchels or backpacks. They also are limited to thrusting and thrown missile weapons.

-4 Alien Mentality: Wild Kreen packs eat anything, including members of the sentient races. They have little concept of money or possessions and lack the physical ability to reproduce most humanoid languages (some of the trills and pops of the Halfling language are an exception). They suffer a -4 to their Charisma when dealing with the humanoid races. See Poverty hindrance and Outsider hindrance.

[ValhallaGH]

You are correct that the math does not work in the new rules.

[pnwrunner]

As for the ideas about the lizard race...the original setting had Dray, sSurrans and Nikaal, but none are anything but lizard-y people. No sizzle. So far you two are giving these guys some pop.

[dentris]

With races like Thri-Kreen and Half-Giants, I would strongly advise you to give all races at least a +4 or even +6 balance.

Humans would have a free Edge, +2 skill points and one Attribute at d6. (Total of +6)

That would allow for more powerful races.


As for chameleon, it depends how closely you want to mimic nature. Their color-changing abilities are not as powerful as Hollywood tends to portray. Many species can only change from light green to brownish depending if they are in trees or on the ground.

I would give them:
+2 Stealth if they are immobile. (+1)
Danger Sense Edge (for their 360 vision) (+2)
+4 to resist heat and thirst (+1)
-4 to resist cold (-1)
D6 Vigor (2)

[Deskepticon]

With races like Thri-Kreen and Half-Giants, I would strongly advise you to give all races at least a +4 or even +6 balance.

I satisfactorily balanced both at +4 using converted 3.5 stats. Is Dark Sun much different?

Humans would have a free Edge, +2 skill points and one Attribute at d6. (Total of +6)

If it's a choice of which attribute gets the increase, I personal value that as +3 because of the crazy synergy that can occur. This would mean they only get 1 bonus skill point... or to use SWADE terminolgy, one skill begins at d4 and the max is d12+1.

But you don't really need to boost every race to the same point value. What I did when converting powerful 3.5 races (the ones with ECL adjustments) was give them a similar adjustment figure. A +1 adjustment meant the race needs to take a Minor Hindrance at no extra benefit; +2 would mean a Major (or two Minor) Hindrances need to be taken. These DO count toward the usual limit of 4 points, meaning powerful races can be included without needing to bump every other race to the same level.

I would give them:
+2 Stealth if they are immobile. (+1)
Danger Sense Edge (for their 360 vision) (+2)
+4 to resist heat and thirst (+1)
-4 to resist cold (-1)
D6 Vigor (2)

+4 to resist heat and thirst is two separate Hazards, so it should be valued as +2.
Also, I'm not sure Danger Sense is entirely appropriate since it's somewhat supernatural. It detects ALL kinds of danger, not just from things that can be seen. I would just give them +2 to sight-based Notice rolls (for a +1 evaluation).