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  • Savage Worlds X-Crawl

    Hello,

    I'm a big fan of Brendan LaSalle's X-Crawl setting. Has anyone else taken a shot at trying to convert it to Savage Worlds? I think it would be a good fit.

    At some point in the near future, I will start working on it.

  • #2
    Oh, X-Crawl. The overlap of D&D, reality television, and sports gambling. And all before The Hunger Games was written.
    It's been years since I thought about it.

    The basics are extremely easy to convert. Combat rules, basic gear, critters, etc.
    Traps will be a bit of an issue, since you want them to be more interesting than "you moved here, roll Agility ... now roll Vigor ... now make a new character." Take a look at TAG's Perilous Places and Serious Situations.
    Some iconic monsters will need to be created. I'd recommend modeling the "instant kill" abilities, like petrification, on the Poison rules.
    You'll need a "fan base" mechanic for how fans can affect a Crawl.
    You'll need to decide what kinds of magical gear are allowed - different rules require different mechanics for magical equipment.
    Other than that, should be very simple.
    I hope you find the above post useful. And not insulting, because I was trying to be helpful, not insulting; being a pedantic jerk, that isn't always clear.

    Comment


    • #3
      It sounds like a fantasy version of The Running Man.

      Comment


      • #4
        The rules for trap-making in Perilous Places left me underwhelmed, so I created my own rules using a similar design. You can download the document for free by clicking here. Maybe you'll find them useful.

        Comment


        • #5
          Originally posted by Deskepticon View Post
          The rules for trap-making in Perilous Places left me underwhelmed, so I created my own rules using a similar design. You can download the document for free by clicking here. Maybe you'll find them useful.
          Awesome work, thank you! You can be sure that I'll credit you for this.

          Comment


          • Deskepticon
            Deskepticon commented
            Editing a comment
            Cool! Thanks.
            But credit also goes to Wiggy for the original idea. I only adapted to a different model.
            In turn, feel free to change whatever doesn't work for you.

        • #6
          I finished a preliminary document, along with 10 sample characters. I kept the characters blank slates as Brendan LaSalle does for his convention games. I can put them in a google doc, or send them to you via email. Just send me your email via PM, please.

          Comment


          • Deskepticon
            Deskepticon commented
            Editing a comment
            A link to the document from this thread is probably the best option.

        • #7
          How's this? http://docs.google.com/document/d/1k...it?usp=sharing

          Comment


          • #8
            And the characters: https://docs.google.com/document/d/1...it?usp=sharing

            Comment


            • #9
              You all should be able to edit and make comments on both documents

              Comment


              • #10
                Did any of you guys get a chance to take a look?

                Comment


                • Deskepticon
                  Deskepticon commented
                  Editing a comment
                  I browsed through it when you first posted, but haven't gone back for a deep-dive.
                  Sorry.

                  I will take another look as soon as I get a chance.

              • #11
                Okay, I took another look.

                Before getting into the nitty-gritty, I'd like to brush upon some general feedback first. I gather from reading the Introduction that you plan on releasing this document publicly once it's complete. It'd be a good idea to familiarize yourself with the Licensing Terms before you do. Also, download (and read!) the free Style Guide so your doc looks like a Savage product.

                With that out of the way...

                Setting Rules
                That's a fairly long list of Setting Rules, and that doesn't even factor in that Mojo, Grandstanding, and Fame are all also technically Setting Rules. I'm not saying this is a bad thing, just that there's a lot for player's (and GMs) to keep track of.

                Races
                Other than suggesting you use proper formatting when presenting the races, the dwarves, elves, half-elves, halflings, and humans are pretty much straight from SWADE, so you can probably just say, "use the entries in the core book", rather than re-producing them. You really just need new entries for the Gnome and Half-orc.

                Half-orcs look fine, but Gnomes (and Halflings) shouldn't have the Small Hindrance; they should have the Size -1 ability. This allows players to take Small during char-gen if they want to play a more frail version of the race.

                Mojo
                I'm not exactly sure what to think of this yet, but my initial gut reaction is not to like it. Not only are players forbidden from spending a Benny on themselves, but they aren't even allowed to ASK a teammate for help. These are the types of rules that force players to make secret pacts behind the GM's back: "If I blink twice, give me a Benny." It's ultimately self-defeating. And if the GM catches on, the rules require that the player be disqualified. It just turns the Game Master into the enemy, and that's no fun.

                Adding insult to injury, if a player Crit Fails a roll, they ALSO lose a Benny! That just punishes every other player for one character's screw-up.

                Bonus Core Skills
                This is essentially a restricted version of the More Skill Points Setting Rule. It should probably be mentioned in the Character Creation chapter of the document.

                Grandstanding
                I like this!
                I have no idea what it does, but I like it! The rule needs an explanation of what game effect it has. I know it adds Fame, but if that is its only function, it should be mentioned as of sub-rule of Fame, not a separate thing.

                What Actor Plays Your Character
                Okay, maybe this is explained better in the original game, but I am thoroughly confused. Does this mean if I want to be Ronald Reagan "playing" a steel cowboy I get +1 Fame?

                Regardless, this should probably be part of char-gen... or maybe a Background Edge. I won't know until I learn more.

                Occupation
                So... a player decides what a character's "day job" is, and if it relates to a task they get +1? This is already part of the core rules, handled through Comprehensive Modifiers.

                Special Moves
                No idea what these are or how they work, so I don't know if a d8 Wild Die is a balanced mechanic for them.

                Fame
                Yaaay, Number Tracking !!!
                I jest. Nobody likes number tracking... especially every time their character gets in a drunken brawl and smashes a storefront window while publicly insulting the arresting officer while their pregnant wife causes a scene. (What's the total on that?)

                The rewards are crazily skewed: 20 points to buy the Connections Edge; 40 to buy a Combat or Leadership Edge; 60 to buy a Benny (that you can't spend on yourself); 40 points to buy ten followers (the equivalent of two Legendary Edges); 80 points to buy Sidekick... ...

                Heroic Status presumably stacks with the Fame/Famous Edges, and since it can be taken at least four times, the character can receive as much as +6 to Persuasion and Performance rolls. Maybe more.

                Immortal Legend has a cost of "Heroic Status ×4", which I guess means once you buy your fourth Heroic Status for 20 points, it automatically unlocks Immortal Legend.

                To put this into perspective, for 80 Fame points you can buy the Sidekick Edge... or for 80 points you can buy Heroic Status ×4 (with all its benefits) and unlock Immortal Legend for free, which gets you 20 followers and a Sidekick (a 160 point value).


                Since most of the Fame rewards are just Edges anyway, I'd look for ways to tie Advancement directly to Fame.
                Last edited by Deskepticon; 01-28-2020, 07:43 AM.

                Comment


                • #12
                  Awesome, thank you for going over this! My responses are below the quotes.

                  Originally posted by Deskepticon View Post
                  Okay, I took another look.
                  I appreciate it.

                  Originally posted by Deskepticon View Post
                  Before getting into the nitty-gritty, I'd like to brush upon some general feedback first. I gather from reading the Introduction that you plan on releasing this document publicly once it's complete. It'd be a good idea to familiarize yourself with the Licensing Terms before you do. Also, download (and read!) the free Style Guide so your doc looks like a Savage product.
                  Originally posted by Deskepticon View Post
                  With that out of the way...

                  Setting Rules
                  That's a fairly long list of Setting Rules, and that doesn't even factor in that Mojo, Grandstanding, and Fame are all also technically Setting Rules. I'm not saying this is a bad thing, just that there's a lot for player's (and GMs) to keep track of.
                  It's a good point, but these setting rules are what keeps the "feel" of XCrawl in Savage Worlds, especially for players used to the DCC or Pathfinder versions. Fast healing and gritty damage are the two optional rules that I could get rid of.

                  Originally posted by Deskepticon View Post
                  Races
                  Other than suggesting you use proper formatting when presenting the races, the dwarves, elves, half-elves, halflings, and humans are pretty much straight from SWADE, so you can probably just say, "use the entries in the core book", rather than re-producing them. You really just need new entries for the Gnome and Half-orc.

                  Half-orcs look fine, but Gnomes (and Halflings) shouldn't have the Small Hindrance; they should have the Size -1 ability. This allows players to take Small during char-gen if they want to play a more frail version of the race.
                  That's an easy fix. I'll try to use the proper formatting if I ever "publish" this- it's in draft and play-testing right now.

                  Originally posted by Deskepticon View Post
                  Mojo
                  I'm not exactly sure what to think of this yet, but my initial gut reaction is not to like it. Not only are players forbidden from spending a Benny on themselves, but they aren't even allowed to ASK a teammate for help. These are the types of rules that force players to make secret pacts behind the GM's back: "If I blink twice, give me a Benny." It's ultimately self-defeating. And if the GM catches on, the rules require that the player be disqualified. It just turns the Game Master into the enemy, and that's no fun.

                  Adding insult to injury, if a player Crit Fails a roll, they ALSO lose a Benny! That just punishes every other player for one character's screw-up.
                  Mojo works that way in the Pathfinder and DCC versions. Granted the bonuses are weaker, as far as being only +1 to roll per mojo spent. Mojo represents the players' ability to work as a team and botches would mess up your teamwork.

                  Savage Worlds is a different system though, and you make a good point if these modifications ruin the enjoyment of the game.


                  Originally posted by Deskepticon View Post
                  Bonus Core Skills
                  This is essentially a restricted version of the More Skill Points Setting Rule. It should probably be mentioned in the Character Creation chapter of the document.
                  Pretty much, yeah.

                  Originally posted by Deskepticon View Post
                  Grandstanding
                  I like this!
                  I have no idea what it does, but I like it! The rule needs an explanation of what game effect it has. I know it adds Fame, but if that is its only function, it should be mentioned as of sub-rule of Fame, not a separate thing.
                  Yes, it does add fame. I'll make sure to make it a sub-rule of fame then.

                  Originally posted by Deskepticon View Post
                  What Actor Plays Your Character
                  Okay, maybe this is explained better in the original game, but I am thoroughly confused. Does this mean if I want to be Ronald Reagan "playing" a steel cowboy I get +1 Fame?

                  Regardless, this should probably be part of char-gen... or maybe a Background Edge. I won't know until I learn more.
                  The game creator uses it as an icebreaker for convention games- not sure if it's that useful for long-term games. That seems to be the case from reading the XCrawl book.

                  Originally posted by Deskepticon View Post
                  Occupation
                  So... a player decides what a character's "day job" is, and if it relates to a task they get +1? This is already part of the core rules, handled through Comprehensive Modifiers.
                  Good to know. I just figured I should spell it out for the players.

                  Originally posted by Deskepticon View Post
                  Special Moves
                  No idea what these are or how they work, so I don't know if a d8 Wild Die is a balanced mechanic for them.
                  Special moves are just the signature move of the player. I will correct this- but it's that the player describes a special move (like in Professional Wrestling). The players gets the increased wild die when they perform it.

                  Originally posted by Deskepticon;n35046[B
                  Fame[/B]
                  Yaaay, Number Tracking !!!
                  I jest. Nobody likes number tracking... especially every time their character gets in a drunken brawl and smashes a storefront window while publicly insulting the arresting officer while their pregnant wife causes a scene. (What's the total on that?)

                  The rewards are crazily skewed: 20 points to buy the Connections Edge; 40 to buy a Combat or Leadership Edge; 60 to buy a Benny (that you can't spend on yourself); 40 points to buy ten followers (the equivalent of two Legendary Edges); 80 points to buy Sidekick... ...

                  Heroic Status presumably stacks with the Fame/Famous Edges, and since it can be taken at least four times, the character can receive as much as +6 to Persuasion and Performance rolls. Maybe more.

                  Immortal Legend has a cost of "Heroic Status ×4", which I guess means once you buy your fourth Heroic Status for 20 points, it automatically unlocks Immortal Legend.

                  To put this into perspective, for 80 Fame points you can buy the Sidekick Edge... or for 80 points you can buy Heroic Status ×4 (with all its benefits) and unlock Immortal Legend for free, which gets you 20 followers and a Sidekick (a 160 point value).


                  Since most of the Fame rewards are just Edges anyway, I'd look for ways to tie Advancement directly to Fame.
                  I'll admit that I based them off of Hellfrost's rewards. Immortal Legend actually should be purchased at 100 fame, it's not free when you have Heroic Status x4.

                  How would you recommend balancing them?

                  Fame in XCrawl (Pathfinder) gives you everything from bonuses to charisma-based rolls, increased wealth, and buys to get favors.

                  Comment


                  • #13
                    Originally posted by grandmastergm View Post

                    I'll admit that I based them off of Hellfrost's rewards. Immortal Legend actually should be purchased at 100 fame, it's not free when you have Heroic Status x4.

                    How would you recommend balancing them?

                    Fame in XCrawl (Pathfinder) gives you everything from bonuses to charisma-based rolls, increased wealth, and buys to get favors.
                    My advice, just don't add them. If people want to be famous, let them choose the Edges themselves during normal character advancement. Famous, Followers, Sidekick, Connections, and many more are all Edges that represent fame. You can also add a few if you want it for flavor, or just give the benefit of an Edge for free if they do something of value. Noting prevents the GM to give his players a handful of extras because they saved a village. No Edge required.

                    Comment


                    • #14
                      Originally posted by ValhallaGH View Post
                      Oh, X-Crawl. The overlap of D&D, reality television, and sports gambling. And all before The Hunger Games was written.
                      It's been years since I thought about it.

                      The basics are extremely easy to convert. Combat rules, basic gear, critters, etc.
                      Traps will be a bit of an issue, since you want them to be more interesting than "you moved here, roll Agility ... now roll Vigor ... now make a new character." Take a look at TAG's Perilous Places and Serious Situations.
                      Some iconic monsters will need to be created. I'd recommend modeling the "instant kill" abilities, like petrification, on the Poison rules.
                      You'll need a "fan base" mechanic for how fans can affect a Crawl.
                      You'll need to decide what kinds of magical gear are allowed - different rules require different mechanics for magical equipment.
                      Other than that, should be very simple.
                      Any suggestions on how to do the fan base mechanic? I did fame similar to Hellfrost and give players the opportunity to cultivate fanbases through grandstanding.

                      Comment


                      • #15
                        Originally posted by grandmastergm View Post
                        It's a good point, but these setting rules are what keeps the "feel" of XCrawl in Savage Worlds, especially for players used to the DCC or Pathfinder versions. Fast healing and gritty damage are the two optional rules that I could get rid of.
                        Oh, I'm not suggesting to slim it down!
                        I was only remarking that players are going to need a way to remember what Setting Rules are in play.

                        Mojo works that way in the Pathfinder and DCC versions. Granted the bonuses are weaker, as far as being only +1 to roll per mojo spent. Mojo represents the players' ability to work as a team and botches would mess up your teamwork.

                        Savage Worlds is a different system though, and you make a good point if these modifications ruin the enjoyment of the game.
                        "Ruin" is a strong word. I just think trying to apply the concept to Bennies would diminish the use of the mechanic. There needs to be some type of player-reward attached to it. Bennies are an iconic part of the system, and taking them away from an individual's control is going to be a major blow.

                        There was a discussion on these forums not too long ago about giving Common Bond (the Edge that lets you share Bennies) a little boost, because it just doesn't feel like it has enough positive reinforcement to justify taking.

                        What Mojo does (as currently written) is gives everyone Common Bond, but forbids them from using their own Bennies... or even asking for help. That last part is clincher. I think it needs to go. I understand what the developer was going for, but not being able to effectively talk to the other players seems restrictive.
                        Hey, maybe I'm wrong! I'm just following my gut here.

                        As for the Mojo rule itself... there's definitely something there, but it needs to be brought out. Maybe having more emphasis on a teamwork and the importance of a teammates success would help. One idea might be: if you give a player a Benny to reroll a failure and they succeed, you get +1 on your next roll. Something like that.

                        Re: Grandstanding
                        Yes, it does add fame. I'll make sure to make it a sub-rule of fame then.
                        See, I'd go the other way. I'd make Fame a subset of Grandstanding. Grandstanding is the "active" rule, it's what the character does to draw attention and gin up a crowd. Fame is just the tally of the result, a meta-currency.

                        I wouldn't limit Grandstanding to just the arena either. A character can "Grandstand" in the streets to keep themselves in the public eye; what we would call "a publicity stunt." This would eliminate the long list of Fame trackers and relegate it to a single mechanic: Grandstanding!

                        What to do about Fame is another matter...

                        The game creator uses it as an icebreaker for convention games- not sure if it's that useful for long-term games. That seems to be the case from reading the XCrawl book.
                        So the rule is exactly what it sounds like? A player can choose a real world celebrity to be their character? So if I wanted to, I could actually be Arnold from Running Man?

                        I mean, I love it! It's silly and kooky, but I don't know if it needs to have a mechanical benefit. I think most players are going to be inspired by a film or book anyway.
                        But, hey!, that's just my two cents. You know the setting better than I do, so you do whatever you think is best.

                        Special moves are just the signature move of the player. I will correct this- but it's that the player describes a special move (like in Professional Wrestling). The players gets the increased wild die when they perform it.
                        Sounds like something that should be an Edge. Players already have a ton of things that can give them an advantage with Creative Combat.

                        I'll admit that I based them off of Hellfrost's rewards. Immortal Legend actually should be purchased at 100 fame, it's not free when you have Heroic Status x4.

                        How would you recommend balancing them?
                        I'm not even sure if I would keep Fame as a "point tally" system. I think I would probably look at creating a "Fanbase" system modelled off of the Reaction Table. There are always going to be people that root for another team, but they aren't your Fanbase. Depending on your actions, your fans are going to absolutely adore you or be angrily disappointed, but they'd generally stick by you... if, perhaps, degrudgingly.

                        If your Fanbase is high, you get better rewards for winning a game, or maybe you get invited to galas downtown, or get discounts at stores. Children want your picture and autograph. If your Fanbase is low, you get crap rewards, or you are publicly shunned, or maybe even egged as someone shouts, "f*gg*t !!!"

                        In this system, the "rewards" for being famous (or notorious) are mostly narrative. If a character wants an Edge, they just pick it up with an Advance. This also allows for more dynamic characters. The low-rent scoundral that no one likes can take Leadership Edges as they bully others around, and there's always people pathetic enough to Follow or Sidekick with such a person.

                        ____

                        Anyway, those are my thoughts.

                        Comment

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