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The werecat and similar lycanthropes -- skill maximum?

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  • The werecat and similar lycanthropes -- skill maximum?

    Okay, so let's say I'm building a werecat (B&B, p. 22) and I put two attribute bumps into Agility. Now I have Agility d8 in human form or Agility d12 in werecat form.

    Which one applies for skill advances? If I want to raise Fighting from d8 to d10, is that one skill point or two?

    I'm torn because on the one hand it seems reasonable to consider the human form the baseline and everything else a bonus. But thematically, the werecat form actually is its natural form, and it seems like those Agility bonuses are weak if they don't help this.

  • #2
    Based on my reading Human is their base form so that should be the one that applies. I will admit it's not 100% crystal clear but it does say under complications that a werecat is considered a human (mutant) and may not select another race.

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    • #3
      I wonder if the fairest ruling would be to just split the difference -- consider my example character to have a virtual Agility d10 only for the purpose of skill advances. A touch more complex, but it means that the bonus gives some effect other than just "better raw Agility checks in monster form, and absolutely nothing else."

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      • #4
        Just like Looking It for the Crazy the Agility boost is primarily there for Evasion.
        Last edited by Wanderingmystic; 10-10-2019, 02:32 PM.

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        • PEGRoberson
          PEGRoberson commented
          Editing a comment
          Correct, Evasion, Tests, and similar reactions.

      • #5
        I would run it like this:. Same points spent, so in different forms fighting is different based on agility max.

        So if they spent 5 points on fighting. d8 base agility. Fighting would be d10 in human form, d12 in were-cat form.

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        • Ndreare
          Ndreare commented
          Editing a comment
          A little complicated, but a good solution

      • #6
        Originally posted by Gancis View Post
        I would run it like this:. Same points spent, so in different forms fighting is different based on agility max.

        So if they spent 5 points on fighting. d8 base agility. Fighting would be d10 in human form, d12 in were-cat form.
        Actually, that's really fair, and for the specific case of a +2d attribute bump, it simplifies to a flat +1d skill bump if you've raised the skill above the base attribute.

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        • pkitty
          pkitty commented
          Editing a comment
          I phrased it like this, which I think is pretty straightforward. This is for the crazy; similar rule noted for the werecat.

          "While you're Losing It, any Agility-linked skill which has been raised above your base Agility (before the Losing It boost) is temporarily increased by one die type. For example, if you have Agility d8 and Fighting d10, when Losing It you would have Agility d12 and Fighting d12."

      • #7
        BTW, in case anyone's interested our (fairly minor) house rules for the new Savage Rifts are here (including this new one), along with a page for new D-Bees (mostly converted from oRifts), and a master list of every framework and race:

        http://mygurps.com/pmwiki.php?n=Main.SavageRifts

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        • #8
          Originally posted by pkitty View Post
          Okay, so let's say I'm building a werecat (B&B, p. 22) and I put two attribute bumps into Agility. Now I have Agility d8 in human form or Agility d12 in werecat form.

          Which one applies for skill advances? If I want to raise Fighting from d8 to d10, is that one skill point or two?

          I'm torn because on the one hand it seems reasonable to consider the human form the baseline and everything else a bonus. But thematically, the werecat form actually is its natural form, and it seems like those Agility bonuses are weak if they don't help this.
          Human is their base form. They are humans.
          Sean Owen Roberson
          Line Editor, Rifts for Savage Worlds

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          • pkitty
            pkitty commented
            Editing a comment
            Okay, thanks. Though I can't help pointing out that in oRifts, they are NOT humans -- werecats are a race, just like dragons.

            (Also, still love Gancis' suggested rule too much to not use it, but I absolutely acknowledge that it's a house rule and not RAW.)

        • #9
          The Agility increase a werecat gets when it transforms is an increase to their natural potential. I don't see how that can retroactively affect the learned ability of the Fighting skill.

          I view it as analagous to increasing an attribute via an advance. If the character had previously increased Fighting above the linked attribute (spending 2 skill points or a full Advance), they don't retroactively earn that skill point back when the attribute gets a bump. The effort was already spent with the potential the character had at the time... you can't get back energy you already used.

          That being said, learning a new die for a skill linked to the werecat's Agility is another matter. If the character spends most of their time training in cat-mode, I can see using the higher Agility value to determine skill cost. Again, it represents working with a higher potential; if the potential isn't there, the character doesn't benefit from it.

          So rather than constantly shifting skill dice around during game, concentrate on how new skill dice are gained. Sometimes they use the human potential, sometimes the werecat potential. That's a discussion between the player and GM. Remember, spending a lot of time in cat-form to gain a skill advantage is going to come with social drawbacks, so there's a quid-pro-quo involved.

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