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  • LC Feedback

    So, the lost colony feedback link goes to the Official Deadlands Questions forum, but that forum's locked. Suppose we're waiting for the real forum to open?

    As an aside, reading through now. First impressions, dude.... Cleaned up a lot of the weirdness that was in the original book, and Shane's forward seems to demystify the state of the original LC books. Cool. I do NOT, however, enjoy the Red Font on Red Background parts you get in the book. Any red text, such as the titles of the critters, bleeds right into the Dealdands Lost Colony tag on the upper Left/Right of each page. Makes it REAL hard to read.

  • #2
    Also, question, howcome Blacklinners, despite being very obviously addicted to their injections, not have the Major Habit hindrance? Kinda seems their thing.


    • #3
      I'll add some preliminary feedback of my own, if that's okay with you.

      - A scale for distances would be really helpful for the map of Banshee.
      - The note about languages mentions "appropriate Knowledge skill[s]." That should be Language.
      - The Ailin' Hindrance talks about Minor vs. Major versions, but it's listed as only a Major Hindrance.
      - Under Lyin' Eyes, "This includes Gambling in the game features any element of bluffing." "In" should be "if."


      • #4
        Here's my big list of stuff I saw. I'll give it another lookover later.

        There's a lot of issues with the numbers at the bottom corner. Too many to point out. I can if you need me to.
        The red tabs on the far side of the pages makes it REAL hard to read the text underneath. Especially when that text is red itself.
        pg. 37, Banshee Born. Shouldn't this be only at character creation?
        pg. 38, Colonial Ranger. How much ammo do they get for free? Do they get to request grenades? Or get free grenades?
        pg. 41, Availability. So I assume if its not in the chapter, its not for sale, but maybe could still be found (such as a remnant from travelers thru the Hunting Grounds?)?
        pg. 42, Recycled Goods. I'd wonder about Recycled Armor. Maybe a Crit Failure on a soak roll causes the Armor to loose one point of protection, until it just falls apart?
        pg. 43, Eva Pack. Missing its notes.
        pg. 43, Ghost Rock. Shows up both in Fundaments and in General Equipment, with two different price ranges. Axe the one from General Equipment.
        pg. 45, Human Armor. How come only the Armored Spacesuit has the Ballistic Protection ability, unlike all modern and future armor from SWADE? Check pg. 70, SWADE for verification. Also, can Spacesuits and Tox Suits become compromised from damage? I would assume having a bullet rupture be very bad in space or in a toxic pit.
        pg. 46, Chakira. Does the spear mode also grant +1 parry like other spears? Or is it too big for a parry bonus? And in lance mode, does it have AP 2 like other lances when charging?
        pg. 46, Mini-Chainsaw. How come these modify damage via Strength, unlike normal chainsaws? I'd recommend 2d6+2 or even 2d4+4.
        pg. 47, Anouk Ranged Weapons. I assume all these have the Tannis tag?
        pg. 47, Chakira. It has +1 Parry here when thrown. Should this be removed and put back in the previous page (as well as AP 2 when charging in lance mode?)
        pg. 48, Flechette Gun. Most scifi settings have flechettes do terrible damage to armored foes. Like increase AP of armor struck by +1 or +2 or something. Just a thought.
        pg. 49, HI Blazer. How come it has less damage and range than the Damnation, but uses the same ammo type? 10mm shots are pretty deadly. Don't see why its weaker.
        edit: second thought, 2d6+1 should be max for 10mm. Also it's a pistol round. Why is it in aisle l assault rifles?
        pg. 50, Machine Guns. We established starting in SWADE that machine guns typically have a Minimum RoF. I assume the rule from SWADE stating machine-guns still have a Min RoF of 2, among the other restrictions for Machine Guns, ala SWADE? What about the SAWs? Both have aparently a burst fire selector. Do they have the Min Rof?
        Not saying they should be cut in paste the rules for machine-guns from SWADE. Just thinking here, because some people might forget the special rules machine guns follow.
        pg. 51, Rocket Launcher. Weird lore here. Real weird. Just in the preceeding weapon entry (Boom Tube), it says EXFOR did not requisition anti-tank weapons, yet this exists, which is deadlier and higher AP than the boom tube. So which is correct?
        pg. 52, Caseless Rounds. How many caseless rounds do you get for the cost? It doesn't say here.
        pg. 53, Vehicular Weapons. More just asking. Like Machine Guns, I assume we follow the same rules for VW as we do in SWADE, including the min RoF for Autocannons?
        pg. 55, Gorgon APC and Mule. What fuel type do they use?
        pg. 55, Gorgon APC. Does its missile launcher work like spacecraft? IE, can it fire up to four missiles at once?
        pg. 58, EXFOR Dropship. How many missile launchers does it have equipped? It just lists how many missiles, so no idea how many can be fired at once.
        pg. 61, Missile Launcher. How many medium missiles can it fire?
        pg. 63, Settings Rules. Noticed that we're missing a few settings rules that have been established since Noir. Namely Gritty Damage (since the other two are now permanent rules). Did the Weird West (as well as Wasted, Way Out, and Concrete) become a little less dangerous for our intrepid heroes?
        Also, Dynamic Backlash is added, but it seems the only one that uses it is the Anouk Shaman (and MAYBE other ABs from other eras?).
        pg. 63, Gravity & Space, 4th Paragraph, last sentance. This seems out of place. It seems to insinuate the other locations in the preceeding sentance are Low Gravity. Are they?
        pg. 64, the number at the bottom is really funky.
        pg. 64, Vacuum. This one poses an interesting question. Can Harrowed survive space? They're dead so they don't have any bodily fluids other than the occasional liquor. Pg. 176 says Constructs and Undead are immune to vacuum unless otherwise stated. This follows with Harrowed too?
        pg. 67. Out of Control and Crashes. I dunno. Couldn't you have a crash if you're in the same square as your opponent? How often do we see out of control pilots crash into cruisers and stuff in cinema.
        pg. 69. Anouk Shaman. One, is this going to be for Shamans too where its a new AB but tied to Miracles? Why not just use AB Miracles? Also, their spell list, speed needs to be sloth/speed, unless they only get Speed. Also, it i'd suggest giving them entangle. Seems a very shaman-y power. Lastly, these guys are hard to get into. The Edge tax here's pretty high, especially if you wanna be a human shaman (gotta have both Banshee Born AND Tannis Touch). All that for a smaller list than traditional shamans and some heavy restrictions (gotta have tannis if they're off banshee, their artificer edge only works on anouk-like beings, etc).
        pg. 70, Banshee's Howl. Does the Modifier Tornakijkdo also affect the shaman? If so, I hope the shaman throws Selective in there.....
        pg. 71-73, Breaker. Honestly, Burst doesn't fit in here. I'd remove burst, and change Breakdown's Area Effect Modifier to incude a Cone Template at +2. That way it just stays consistent. Alternately, could Breakers use a new universal power modifier that allows them to Ace damage on objects, and just give them back Bolt and Blast? This would allow Burst and Damage Field to "breakdown" objects around them. One huge problem I have with Breakers is they're so narrowly focused. They only have 9 powers, and start with 3. That means it only takes 4 edges (AB and Extra Powers x3) to get EVERY power a breaker can have. I think breakers need some more powers. I'd like to see Smite (using nanites crawling along their weapons to break down objects struck) for instance.
        pg. 71, Backlash. Do they still roll on the Dynamic Backlash table as well? Remember, we added Dynamic Backlash as a setting rule.
        pg. 72, New Breaker Powers. Isn't the text under this suppose to be under the Trappings header? Seperate this, put a Trappings header under this, and under Breaker Powers, put in: Breakers have access to [X] new powers:
        pg. 75, The Ballad of Life. What's the range of this power?
        pg. 75 Tannis Bomb. What size blast template?
        pg. 77, Dominion. The sentance beginning "The Harrowed can let..." is repeated in both the 2nd and 3rd paragraph under this header, at the end of each paragraph, word for word.
        pg. 80, Sykers. Same issue I had with Shamans' AB.
        pg. 80, Sykers Power List. Slow isn't a seperate power anymore. Need to replace it and Speed with Sloth/Speed.
        pg. 80, Brainburn. Do they still roll on the Dynamic Backlash table as well? Remember, we added Dynamic Backlash as a setting rule.
        pg. 99, Instability Table, Result 17-19. what happens if they have the Major as well?
        pg. 155, Sophie's Harrowed Abilities. Honestly, I'd drop the +2 Toughness and put Undead in its place. There's ALOT of abilities undead get that we're missing here.
        pg. 165, Major Lee Bansen. Missing damage for the grenades.
        pg. 167, Vanessa. What's her true form look like? Also, her claws. Does she ONLY have improved frenzy when she uses her claws? Its listed as one of her Edges.
        pg. 167, Martool. Shouldn't his ka'nil do Str+d6+2 damage? Also his Parry doesn't reflect the staff's Parry bonus, needs to be 5/6, and his Tougness is missing his Size 1 bonus (needs to be Toughness 8). AND its missing Reach 1.
        pg. 168, Dave Ross. He doesn't have any mini grenades?
        pg. 169, War. Does not have an Athletics score. She's also missing her Low Tech and Size Special Abilities...
        Kinda sad we don't have his horse. It was in the original.
        pg. 170, Anouk Warrior, Veteran. Has an Edge called Fury of Stone, but this Edge doesn't exist. Also its Tougness needs to be 11 (3). You missed the Size +1.
        pg. 170, Anouk Shaman. Same issue with Martool's ka'nil. Parry needs to be 5/6, and the ka'nil needs to be Str+d6+2, Reach 1).
        pg. 170, Azeel Clan Warrior. Has the Anouk Edge, trade it for Adapted as per their lore text. Also need to up Parry to 7 because of Block Edge. Lastly, kill the Low-Tech Special Ability; the Adapted Edge kills that.
        pg. 171, Blackliner. Need the Habit (Major) - Blackline hindrance.
        Pg. 171, BDF Soldier. I'd give them the Soldier Edge myself.
        pg. 174, HI Marine. Need the Soldier Edge.
        pg. 175, Pirate scattergun. Assuming shotgun rules?
        pg. 175, Snapjack laser cuter. Aren't they suppose to do just 2d10 damage?
        pg. 176, Sykers. If they're suppose to be EXFOR veterans, maybe give them Soldier? It would help with the armor.
        pg. 177, Creatures. Noting here alot of the critters here are missing Athletics. No critter should not have Athletics.
        pg. 177, Barka. Missing Athletics. Even a bull should have Athletics.
        pg. 177 Barouka. Do they really need Fighting? They don't make fighting rolls. Most swarms only have Notice and that's it. Unless you're trying to make them harder to hit, in which I'd just drop Athletics and Fighting, and give them Improved Dodge and maybe Block or Improved Block. Thats my 2 cents.
        pg. 181, Deathbloom. Quick question. Are Harrowed immune to the spores? Aka are they considered poison?
        pg. 181, Devourer, first sentance. Space-like squids is an awkward word, and it doesn't really show anything. Shouldn't it be space-dwelling?
        Pace should be -. They can only fly I assume? or should they have a pace when they land on asteroids too?
        Last edited by magusrogue; 01-11-2020, 10:20 PM.


        • wmarshal
          wmarshal commented
          Editing a comment
          Regarding the HI Blazer I think the issue is due to that weapon being listed as both a submachine gun and assault rifle. The stats make sense for a submachine gun. It’s inclusion in the assault rifle section is probably a mistake.

          However, the 10mm round is a pistol round, and its use by the HI Damnation is questionable. Even with a longer barrel I don’t see the 10mm round doing more damage than the 5.56.

        • magusrogue
          magusrogue commented
          Editing a comment
          I agree actually. 10mm according to an ammo chart I saw for SW lists as 2d6+1 max and only for pistols/smg's

        • zgreg
          zgreg commented
          Editing a comment
          Impressive list of catches I've got some remarks, though:

          Dynamic backlash comes with a comment that it applies only to AB's which don't specify one. This indeed leaves only the shamans. I agree that it'd help to have that stated openly there.

          LC's fletchette gun states openly that it shoots plastic shards and is designed to be safe to use aboard a spaceship so lack of AP is natural.

          [potential spoilers]
          Harrowed and vacuum both Floater savage tale (p153) and the "A billion miles from home" adventure indicate that vacuum is no problem for the Harrowed.

      • #5

        pg. 182, Fallen. Rapid Recharge makes no sense here. They have unlimited PP. I'd rather them have something else. Also the book mentions that Fallen can make Walkin' Dead but don't have the Zombie power. Might wanna check on that, either by adding the Zombie power or getting rid of the mention of Fallen under Walkin' Dead on pg. 190
        pg. 184, Kooratcha. Missing Athletics.
        pg. 184, Nahlaak. Missing Athletics.
        pg. 184-185. Prowler. If these things are 10 feet long, I'd give them Size 2. Also up their Toughness to 13 (4). Maybe Size 1 (toughness 12 (4)), if they're really thin but long.
        pg. 185, Qui'tok. Toughness needs to be 12 (2).
        pg. 186, Razor Wing. Another swarm that has Fighting. See my comments on the Barouka.
        pg. 186. Skinnies. So they have unlimited PP? And the Zombie power? That means these guys can have literal armies of permanent zombies.... Yikes. Also do Skinnies not recieve Size 1 from their anouk bodies? If so, up their Toughness to 10 (2).
        Also, shouldn't they have improved Arcane Resistance? I'd figure affecting them with magic would be REAL hard, and their coup grants it as well.
        pg. 187, Slasher. Missing Athletics.
        pg. 188, Ta'roukil. If its the size of a pony, it should have Size 1. The things are built.
        pg. 189, Tohraka. Missing Athletics.
        pg. 190, Walkin' Dead. Missing Athletics.
        pg. 190, Worhul. I wouldn't have the extra text on Tentacles. Just give them the Swat ability, linked to tentacles. Swat is so underused.


        • #6
          Table of Contents in sidebar is out of order in 3 different Linux PDF (Okular, Evince, muPDF) readers as well as MacOS preview.

          Link to full-sized image:
          Click image for larger version  Name:	DLC-TOC-Out-Of-Order.png Views:	0 Size:	355.0 KB ID:	34285
          Author/Developer of
          Proud Member of the Lone Star Savages
          NaNoWriMo 2014, 2015, 2016, 2017, 2018. 2019 Winner


          • #7
            Page 176, Sykers: I presume their "Blasting" skill is supposed to be Psionics? This also applies for the Sykergeist stats on 188.
            Page 186, Skinnies: I'd personally give these guys a Common Knowledge skill and a Persuasion skill. But I'm not sticklers on what die types they get.
            Page 187, Sticky Bugs: Strength d4 seems much too high for creatures as small as this. I think it should be Strength 1, as talked about on Page 179 of SWADE. (For what it's worth, I don't think braincrawlers need their Strength changed even though they're the same size. I can just chalk that up to their supernatural origins.)
            Last edited by werenimal; 01-07-2020, 11:43 PM.


            • magusrogue
              magusrogue commented
              Editing a comment
              Crud I missed the Common Knowledge and Persuasion there. I was trying to be thorough on the Core Skills on critters, as a lot of them are missing some core stuff.

          • #8
            I actually really like Breakers. They get some automatic bonuses outside of their power list (ignoring dim/dark lighting penalties and a +2 to science) which helps to mitigate the tiny power list, and Breakdown and Haywire are actually huge. Especially Breakdown. I'm salivating at getting to play a Breaker just for the sheer nonsense potential of Breakdown. Goodbye, walls! Goodbye armor and equipment! What's that? Somebody's pointing a gun at me on a spaceship? Hope you like getting spaced into the infinite void, nerd! I think the acing breaking dice are maybe a little too powerful to be a universal modifier, or even a power-specific modifier. It makes sense to restrict it to one power. Using your Damage Field example, how on earth do you quantify that? You just start breaking the equipment and walls of anything in range? Wouldn't that mean you just instantly nuke everything in a blast template around yourself if you roll a 12+?

            I can't see them having most other SWADE powers without restrictions. Lower Trait seems like it would make sense, but the nanites just eat things, so that being a mechanically temporary effect doesn't really make sense. Ditto Entangle and Sloth (via mulching the ground into quicksand), which were my other kneejerk reactions. I could see Smite, but I almost feel like it would necessitate destroying the weapon you put it on when the power wears off.

            I do have a few observations:
            -P. 36, the edge description for Arcane Background (Breaker) links to the Marshal's Section for more info, not No Man's Land.
            -P. 71 refers to Disable and Wreck, which I'm assuming were prototype names for Haywire and Breakdown, respectively.
            -P. 72 refers to the "mute or breaker", when Mutes don't exist anymore.

            Outside of breakers, do the new Dominion rules make it so that you can only change Dominion by letting the devil out? That's the way it reads to me, and that's a pretty big oof to the overall balance of Harrowed. On the plus side, thanks for making Wither not absolutely silly, that's one I've had to houserule for years.


            • magusrogue
              magusrogue commented
              Editing a comment
              I'm on the edge on Breakers. They're really really limited... even with the +2 to spot and LLV, that's only worth like 2 racial points. And having such a limited list... Its really weird. Now their Transmute ability I can see being really useful outside combat. Stuck in a jail cell? Take a few minutes to eat the wall.

              As far as Harrowed, i thought the same, but it seems maybe even outside dramatic scenes, sometimes the gm can have the manitou mess with you. It might need a bit more balancing, but allowing Harrowed to now suffer Fatigue from things like Bumps and Bruises, along with making Wither not permanent, definately helps. Also lowering the Claw damage is good. I did the math once, and a harrowed with Supernatural Attribute (Strength and Vigor), Brawler/Bruiser, and Martial Artist/Warrior can get up to a toughness of 13, +2 Fighting, and deal 2d12+6 damage barehanded. Toss in Weapon Master to make it even more ridiculous. Its not much of a change, but 2d12+5 and AP 2 is a bit more cinematic, while not helping against unarmored foes.
              Last edited by magusrogue; 01-08-2020, 06:04 PM. Reason: went a bit overboard with the toughness. Though throw Brawny in, and you can get a toughness of 14....

            • AlanaRay
              AlanaRay commented
              Editing a comment
              Yeah, Harrowed are overall more balanced and I'm a big fan of that. I'm tempted to port my HoE harrowed characters over to LC and just still keep the rule of forcing a Dominion check/hour of possession off a benny. It's just weird that the rules got less specific about it and not more.

              I had somebody theoretically make the exact same build for fun! SWADE and Harrowed can get nuts real fast. That's part of why I really like the "oops, I control your monster truck of a character for a little while" standard.

          • #9
            Breakers, Cybernetics, p.72 : it says that the implants "heal" themselves when the character makes healing rolls.

            Does this mean that a character that has an arm chopped off still has the diffuser tubes (those that went from the reservoirs to his palms) protuding out of his shoulder up until the now missing arm and hand ? That'd be creepy as hell.
            If not, maybe add a line that says that the implants cannot function without a body surrounding them, or something like this ?


            • AlanaRay
              AlanaRay commented
              Editing a comment
              I think it's largely up to you/your Marshal on flavor. I'm building a Breaker and pulled One Arm as my VotWoW hindrance. Tinkering with the idea that they do grow back and she just has to "trim" them every few weeks so they don't get in the way.

          • #10
            Page 49. AK2074 is listed as the 2047 in one instance of the notes


            • #11
              P.33, 37, 39, 69, 74 : Banshee is refered to as "living planet".

              Wasn't this supposed to be THE secret of the setting ? I don't recall anything implying that the PC should be aware of this reality as a fact, but at best a rumor? I know the Guardians are Banshee's protectors, but still... it strikes me as odd.
              Last edited by Meister; 01-09-2020, 12:03 PM.


              • AlanaRay
                AlanaRay commented
                Editing a comment
                There's a lot of things like that. HoE Reloaded gives up pretty much all the setting secrets, including exactly where Raven is, what he's up to, everything that happened during the events of the Unity, etc.

                Hell, just to expand on it: The foreword from Shane says it's a living planet. I guess the cat's outta the bag on this one.

            • #12
              p169, War's coup grants the No Mercy edge but isn't this a core SWADE rule now?


              • ValhallaGH
                ValhallaGH commented
                Editing a comment
                Nope. The Edge remains. It increases damage totals by +2 if you spend a benny to reroll damage.

              • steelbrok
                steelbrok commented
                Editing a comment
                Missed that one, I stand corrected

            • #13
              p. 16 : Is this Tunnel Station or Goliath's Belt ? A title for those pictures would help.
              p.21 : what is this "50 miles" at the top left side ? The only mention I found of "50 miles" put in the south east instead.
              p.51 : Stunners description misses a "have" when mentionning the batteries, in the last sentence.
              p.57 : I find the part about fuel a bit lacking. What kind of fuel is it ? Is it increasingly hard to come by or are Banshee's/the Belt's ressources so vast that we shouldn't really bother beyond the price ?
              p.62 : Gravity Drives : what "range" does it have ? When mentionning the Train Yards, it's not clear how many Gravity Drives there are (one per car ? one per train ?). Space trains are a choice target, but there's no price anywhere for gravity drives ? Finally, I really miss the part from Classic where soulless bodies (IE, those that are definitively dead) float instead of being still tied to the floor when a GD is activated. It really added flavor to space travels.
              p.95 : it says that any character in the Toxic Jungles must roll vs Fatigue if they don't have Tox Suits. Does this mean that there's Anouk-sized Tox Suit (or any suit, for that matter), that all Anouk living in the Jungles have some kind of "mutation" to resist it, or that they are all constantly Incapacited ?
              p104, 148 : A set of "..." got transformed into a "?" inside a box (sorry, don'y know how to translate in English).
              p150 : it says that the diggers that got killed by the ga'aknouls are now ga'aknoul themselves. On p.182, it says their Infection power only works on Anouks. Which is correct ?

              Edit : forgot this one.
              p.29 : Character concepts, there's no mention of Sykers.
              Last edited by Meister; 01-10-2020, 02:06 PM.


              • #14
                Page 83, Banshee Stone: "Thin-Skinned" is misspelled. Also, which version of the Hindrance?
                Page 186, Skinnies: Again, which version of the Thin-Skinned Hindrance do they have?


                • #15
                  (SOLVED: The stroke around the words was a gradient rather than a solid color. This caused issues for you folks opening it in a browser instead of our recommended Adobe Reader / Acrobat.)

                  Thanks for the feedback, folks! As for the graphics issue, this is what we see on all the computers here. Sounds like some of you are seeing something different. We only use Adobe PDF readers (Acrobat and Reader). We don't recommend looking at it solely in browser.

                  Lost Colony Spread