[Beasts and Barbarians] Map Scale?

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SavageGamerGirl
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[Beasts and Barbarians] Map Scale?

#1 Postby SavageGamerGirl » Thu Jun 14, 2012 10:52 pm

I know the book says that there's no science of geography, and I understand that it's for background and to get across the unknown feeling of the world.

But for figuring out how long it might take to travel from one place to the next, what's the rough scale of miles on the map? How far is it, for example, from Faberterra to Felantium?
'But I don't want to go among mad people,' Alice remarked.
'Oh, you can't help that,' said the Cat: 'we're all mad here.'
The Order of the Dice... OF DOOM!

kaltorak
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#2 Postby kaltorak » Fri Jun 15, 2012 2:12 am

Hi SavageGamergirl!
The Dominions are big as they need to be to satisfy your plots :).
Said so, in a general way, consider that the whole area in the painting of Justinus of Syranthia is more or less equivalent to the area between Norway and Congo (at least if you pay attention to Justinus' records).

About your question, the distance between Faberterra and Felantium, in summer, with good roads, a group of horsemen can do it in two weeks, a while a train of wagons can easily use a month to made the same travel, as will do a group of pilgrims.
On the other side, an imperial courier with a fast chariot and regular change of horses could do it in a week, if he needs to deliver a vital message to the Count of Felantium.

But if you need, a flying demon with a kidnapped girl in the arms could to it in a day and a night :twisted:...

Hope it helps!

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#3 Postby warrenss2 » Sun Jun 17, 2012 9:05 am

SavageGamergirl seems to be developing the useful knack of anticipating my questions. A most excellent talent!!!!

Is there any way we could get a color map of The Dominions?
:blam:

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#4 Postby kronovan » Sun Jun 17, 2012 10:38 pm

I don't mind the mysteries a hand drawn map without cartography details poses to a RPG setting. My problem with that for B&B, is that there's so many good vehicle details in the gear section that I want travel that goes a bit beyond simple narrative. You folks at Gramel just did too well with the setting details. ;)

The southern tip of Norway to Congo is about 6,000 km (3,700miles), so I think I can likely figure out an aproximate scale for you map.

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#5 Postby sablemage » Mon Jun 18, 2012 12:51 pm

One of the things I love about the map is the little pictures all over it. It almost eliminates the need for a supporting narrative; I don't need to tell people there are horse archers in Valk territory, for instance, 'cos there's one right there on the map.

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#6 Postby SavageGamerGirl » Mon Jun 18, 2012 1:00 pm

I love the map, don't get me wrong. It's very evocative of the setting and fun to look at. I was just looking for an idea of how long it might take to get from place to place.

Narrative journeys are fine, and I don't mind starting an adventure in a given city on the other side of the map from the last adventure if that's where the characters need to be, but for in-game journeys it could be useful to know miles or days of travel.
'But I don't want to go among mad people,' Alice remarked.

'Oh, you can't help that,' said the Cat: 'we're all mad here.'

The Order of the Dice... OF DOOM!

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#7 Postby kronovan » Mon Jun 18, 2012 2:48 pm

SavageGamerGirl wrote:Narrative journeys are fine, and I don't mind starting an adventure in a given city on the other side of the map from the last adventure if that's where the characters need to be, but for in-game journeys it could be useful to know miles or days of travel.


Yep, this is sort of where I'm coming from too. I'm big on sea travel in my campaigns and occassionally like to run adventures where such travel is part of it. In such situations its nice to know an approximate distance so I can know where the party should be on certain days. I'll even sometimes subject the party to nasty storms and blow them off course or put them up against a pirate encounter at a certain stage of the journey. And with such great details on nautical vehicles I feel very compelled to do such things in B&B ;)

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#8 Postby kaltorak » Tue Jun 19, 2012 9:27 am

Sorry, guys and girls, but I don't think I'll set in stone distances in the Dread Sea Dominions map.

I have explained my reasons above, but if you REALLY want to have a precise distance of places, you can go with the simple map conversion hinted from Kronovan some posts above: the whole map is 3700 miles (more or less), and it is 6.7 inches tall. It means, more or less, that an inch is around 500 miles.

You can use this one to guesstimate distances. But DON'T consider this an official answer. The official answer is that until someone will invent a precise cartography method in the Dominions, they are big as you want (and you need) :wink:.

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#9 Postby kronovan » Tue Jun 19, 2012 2:20 pm

kaltorak wrote:You can use this one to guesstimate distances. But DON'T consider this an official answer. The official answer is that until someone will invent a precise cartography method in the Dominions, they are big as you want (and you need) :wink:.


That's cool and I respect your design decision on that. I personally never give my players maps with scales on them unless it's appropriate to the setting; i.e. Weird Wars II. Typically I'll only give my players a subsection of the map, so they never even really know the layout of ther rest of the world (Dread Sea Dominions.) As well, they'll always have to do some good roleplaying just to get that limited section of the map. ;) Having a scale is purely for my convenience as GM, to assist with some of the play mechanics around time and distance for adventures involving travel.

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#10 Postby warrenss2 » Thu Jun 21, 2012 4:07 pm

Is there any way we could get a color map of The Dominions?
:blam:

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#11 Postby kaltorak » Fri Jun 22, 2012 7:19 am

It is very unlikely.

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#12 Postby sablemage » Fri Jun 22, 2012 12:10 pm

Since most of the cultures are kinda-sorta ancient Eurasian, you could also go with...

* The main European countries, then as now, are about 500 miles across, with significant error bars on that number. (Remember Odysseus, King of Ithaca? I've seen Ithaca. It's about 5 miles across. At the other extreme, you have the Roman or Persian Empires, which were big even by today's standards.)

* Depending on whose estimates you believe, Roman legionaries marched between 5 and 30 miles per day. So a legion would cross a country in between 2 weeks and 3 months; individual bands of adventurers are probably at the faster end of that spectrum.

* Marco Polo averaged roughly 100 miles per month, and he was mostly following the Silk Road, the major trade route of the day; so a trade caravan or explorer might cross a country in 5 months.

People moved more slowly at that tech level - there's no common language, no common currency, no hotels to speak of, and bandits everywhere.

I resisted not having a map scale to start with, but I soon got my players used to the idea that they travel at what Wiggy calls "the speed of plot".

Just my $0.02... YMMV of course!

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#13 Postby sablemage » Fri Jun 22, 2012 12:12 pm

warrenss2 wrote:Is there any way we could get a color map of The Dominions?


I was planning on using some coloured pencils m'self. :-D

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#14 Postby kronovan » Sat Jun 23, 2012 5:23 pm

sablemage wrote:I resisted not having a map scale to start with, but I soon got my players used to the idea that they travel at what Wiggy calls "the speed of plot".


I'd agree that works with most PnP players, but the majority of players in my next B&B campaign will also be tactical wargamers -including naval themed games- so speed of plot won't fly with them. Even if they don't have a detailed map with a scale, they'd expect me to be working off of one as opposed to making it up as I go. For the other fantasy campaigns I've had those players in, I even used house rule for more strategic chases and vehicle engagements, which have always been a lot of fun for them to play in and me to GM.

So that be my $.02 from the other side of the coin. ;)

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#15 Postby sablemage » Sun Jun 24, 2012 4:44 am

Fair point, Kronovan - it's true that my group doesn't include tactical wargamers, and they might well want more info on scale. About a third of us are lapsed wargamers, the majority have never tried that particular style of play.

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#16 Postby AstroCat » Mon Jun 25, 2012 11:19 am

I figured out what I think is a "good" scale for the map which I use in my campaign... Here is my version:

Dread_Sea_Dominion map with distance

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#17 Postby Brian_Smaller » Sat Sep 29, 2012 10:30 pm

I really like the poetic style map that came with the rule book. However, I wanted that for the players to find/discover at some stage. For myself as GM I have an expanded Dread Sea Dominion map that I have drawn using a simple graphics program, paint_net. If I can figure out how to post a picture I will put it up.
...
...
...
OK - I figured it out:)

Here is a link to the map. It is a Work In Progress and nowhere near finished.

http://www.2shared.com/photo/Rb_zOUIP/B ... ld_Ma.html

Any comments - love to hear them.

Cheers
Brian
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#18 Postby Shadowspawn » Sat Sep 29, 2012 11:35 pm

That's a great map, thank for sharing!

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#19 Postby Brian_Smaller » Sat Sep 29, 2012 11:45 pm

I chose an arbitrary hex scale. Make it whatever you want. I am adding details of the Far East of my campaign world - and other details as I get around to it. More cities, roads, trails, ruins etc

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#20 Postby kaltorak » Sun Sep 30, 2012 1:19 am

Neat :)!


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