Hit Location

Please use carefully and respect the copyrights of the works you convert by placing the appropriate information on your documents.

Moderators: PEG Jodi, The Moderators

Message
Author
User avatar
chillburn
Seasoned
Posts: 152
Joined: Wed Sep 15, 2010 11:43 pm

Hit Location

#1 Postby chillburn » Wed Sep 26, 2012 7:56 am

Thinking of adding a Hit Location roll.
OK, so I recognize that this is not Fast, but it's something my group likes and we miss from DL Classic rules. We also have these neat d12's that have a stick figure man with hit locations:
    two for each arm
    two for each leg
    three for torso
    one for head
I'm thinking of using it in my next game with the following rules (replacing the standard -1 to rolls and pace per wound):
- Four wounds total still results in Incapacitation, doesn't matter how those wounds are spread out.
- Penalties:
    Arm: -1 to all rolls, -2 to any rolls involving the wounded arm (per wound)
    Leg: -2 pace (per wound) [If someone's pace is reduced to 0 then they can only move by spending an action to run d6", or be carried]
    Torso: Standard -1 to all rolls and pace (per wound)
    Head: -2 to all rolls (per wound)
I'm planning to make up little cards to give people as reminders ("Congratulations! You just received a HEAD wound, here's what you get...")
So here are the questions:
    1. Do the penalties seem fairly balanced, given the locations hit?
    2. What about cover? I was thinking of two options:
      A. If an attack hits (after penalties) and would hit a location blocked by cover, then the hit defaults to the torso.
      B. Remove the penalties for firing at someone in cover, but if the location rolled is behind cover, then the target gets armor as per the Obstacles rule

I'm leaning toward B because it seems more realistic and may encourage people to think about called shots, etc. a little more (my group rarely tries called shots, considering the risk not worth the reward).

kronovan
Heroic
Posts: 1062
Joined: Tue Mar 01, 2011 11:22 am

Re: Hit Location

#2 Postby kronovan » Wed Sep 26, 2012 10:30 am

I think your system is doable, but it'll definitely cut down on some of the FFF of gameplay. From your comments you're aware of that though, so no problem if you're willing to make that sacrifice.

chillburn wrote:Leg: -2 pace (per wound) [If someone's pace is reduced to 0 then they can only move by spending an action to run d6", or be carried

Is your intent here to use the run play mechanic for another purpose, like a staggering walk? If not, I have a problem visualizing how someone with wounds to their legs could run.

2. What about cover? I was thinking of two options:
    A. If an attack hits (after penalties) and would hit a location blocked by cover, then the hit defaults to the torso.
    B. Remove the penalties for firing at someone in cover, but if the location rolled is behind cover, then the target gets armor as per the Obstacles rule
[/list]
I'm leaning toward B because it seems more realistic and may encourage people to think about called shots, etc. a little more (my group rarely tries called shots, considering the risk not worth the reward).

I think option B is really your only choice if you want to maintain some form of cover in gameplay, but I think its less than ideal. The -1 to -4 penalty is much more of a factor on a To-hit roll than an obstacle bonus is to toughness. That will depend a lot though on what they're taking cover behind and what damage their foe can deal.

User avatar
Scott A. Woodard
Heroic
Posts: 1309
Joined: Tue Aug 21, 2007 10:55 am
Location: The Portland Shanghai Tunnels
Contact:

#3 Postby Scott A. Woodard » Wed Sep 26, 2012 10:36 am

Like most of us, I want my SW games to be "Fast", "Furious", and "Fun", so if it ever comes down to needing hit locations in my games, I use this "complicated" system available from Chessex :) :

Image
DAVROS: ‘Tar Lubek Ka’leed, Uth Ricta Dal’ek.’ Roughly translated, it means: ‘And on that day, men will become like gods.’ (I, DAVROS: GUILT written by Scott Alan Woodard http://www.bigfinish.com/releases/v/guilt-393)

User avatar
Takeda
Heroic
Posts: 1458
Joined: Tue Apr 28, 2009 9:05 pm

#4 Postby Takeda » Wed Sep 26, 2012 10:53 am

Ogma wrote:Like most of us, I want my SW games to be "Fast", "Furious", and "Fun", so if it ever comes down to needing hit locations in my games, I use this "complicated" system available from Chessex :) :

Image


Cool! I'll have to see if I can find it locally ... because living in Canada if I were to order that and have it shipped over the border I just bought the Brooklyn Bridge. ;)
Dean: "Ya' know she could be faking."
Sam: "Yeah, what do you wanna do, poke her with a stick?"
[Dean nods]
Sam: "Dude, you're not gonna poke her with a stick?"
Supernatural Quotes

User avatar
chillburn
Seasoned
Posts: 152
Joined: Wed Sep 15, 2010 11:43 pm

#5 Postby chillburn » Wed Sep 26, 2012 11:41 am

Ogma wrote:Like most of us, I want my SW games to be "Fast", "Furious", and "Fun", so if it ever comes down to needing hit locations in my games, I use this "complicated" system available from Chessex :) :

Image


That is the d12 I'm talking about.
We also have a version that has words instead of the stick-man, but we don't like it as much (words don't translate perfectly to valid locations):
Image
Last edited by chillburn on Wed Sep 26, 2012 11:49 am, edited 1 time in total.

ValhallaGH
Legendary
Posts: 6497
Joined: Sun Apr 25, 2010 9:15 pm

#6 Postby ValhallaGH » Wed Sep 26, 2012 11:45 am

I just use either the Injuries table for hit locations, or the Classic Deadlands table.
Otherwise, I leave the rules alone.
Arms - roll Strength versus damage or drop the item. (Borrowed from disarm.)
Legs - roll Strength / Agility versus damage or fall prone. (House Rule, inspired by disarm.)
Head - that +4 damage is benefit enough.
"Got a problem? I've got the solution: Rocket Launcher."
"Not against a Servitor."
"... We're all gonna die."

User avatar
chillburn
Seasoned
Posts: 152
Joined: Wed Sep 15, 2010 11:43 pm

#7 Postby chillburn » Wed Sep 26, 2012 11:55 am

ValhallaGH wrote:Head - that +4 damage is benefit enough.


I totally forgot about that. Maybe the penalty for a head shot shouldn't be any worse than torso? Basically the fact that it automatically does +1 wound level is enough. So:

Arm: -1 to all rolls, -2 to any rolls involving the wounded arm (per wound)
Leg: -2 pace (per wound) [If someone's pace is reduced to 0 then they can only move by spending an action to run d6", or be carried]
Torso: Standard -1 to all rolls and pace (per wound)
Head: +4 to damage roll, penalties as Torso

User avatar
chillburn
Seasoned
Posts: 152
Joined: Wed Sep 15, 2010 11:43 pm

Re: Hit Location

#8 Postby chillburn » Wed Sep 26, 2012 11:57 am

kronovan wrote:Is your intent here to use the run play mechanic for another purpose, like a staggering walk? If not, I have a problem visualizing how someone with wounds to their legs could run.


Yes, in this context "run" is really "moving anyway possible".

The game I'm working is going to be based on the "DayZ" mod video game, so running and/or chases should figure prominently.

User avatar
canology
Seasoned
Posts: 136
Joined: Tue Apr 08, 2008 1:04 am

#9 Postby canology » Wed Sep 26, 2012 1:53 pm

I like it, it seems fairly elegant and simple to use. I think that the tension of the hit-location roll and the little extra paperwork (damage to different locations) boost the Fun enough to counterbalance the slight loss of Fast.

That said, Fast is my least important of the F's, so I may be biased. :)

User avatar
Bhoritz
Seasoned
Posts: 117
Joined: Sat May 29, 2010 11:47 am
Contact:

Re: Hit Location

#10 Postby Bhoritz » Wed Sep 26, 2012 1:55 pm

chillburn wrote:- Four wounds total still results in Incapacitation, doesn't matter how those wounds are spread out.

I think that this is the most important point to avoid the "Monty Python Black Knight" syndrom.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zKhEw7nD9C4

newForumNewName
Heroic
Posts: 1799
Joined: Fri Oct 22, 2010 10:17 am
Location: Broomfield, CO

#11 Postby newForumNewName » Wed Sep 26, 2012 2:27 pm

This thread might be relevant.
"I had a whole bunch of advice for you but got ninja'd by newForumNewName. I'd just do what he says." -- 77IM

"While nFNN could be less of a jerk about how he says what he says, what he says is essentially correct." -- ValhallaGH

User avatar
Virgobrown72
Heroic
Posts: 1120
Joined: Tue Jan 19, 2010 7:52 pm
Location: The other side of the Sun, baby!!!

#12 Postby Virgobrown72 » Wed Sep 26, 2012 5:47 pm

I would just use the wounds table...
"That which does not kill me, makes me Shaken..."

User avatar
Takeda
Heroic
Posts: 1458
Joined: Tue Apr 28, 2009 9:05 pm

#13 Postby Takeda » Wed Sep 26, 2012 7:08 pm

That hit location D12 is $7.00 and 28mm tall by the way. I couldn't find it listed on their catalogue so I emailed and that's what I was told.

Cool thing is it's big enough everyone around the table would be able to read it. :-)
Dean: "Ya' know she could be faking."

Sam: "Yeah, what do you wanna do, poke her with a stick?"

[Dean nods]

Sam: "Dude, you're not gonna poke her with a stick?"

Supernatural Quotes

User avatar
johnnii
Seasoned
Posts: 127
Joined: Fri Sep 02, 2011 6:13 am

#14 Postby johnnii » Fri Sep 28, 2012 11:59 pm

I always saw the Gritty damage rules from SWD as the official hit location rule. Any reason to use that or it might be to harsh with penalties?

User avatar
Takeda
Heroic
Posts: 1458
Joined: Tue Apr 28, 2009 9:05 pm

#15 Postby Takeda » Sat Sep 29, 2012 2:11 am

johnnii wrote:I always saw the Gritty damage rules from SWD as the official hit location rule. Any reason to use that or it might be to harsh with penalties?


For combat I'm not going to change anything but for truly random hit location like falling rocks or stray bullets/arrows, etc. the random generation makes sense.
Dean: "Ya' know she could be faking."

Sam: "Yeah, what do you wanna do, poke her with a stick?"

[Dean nods]

Sam: "Dude, you're not gonna poke her with a stick?"

Supernatural Quotes

Mylon
Seasoned
Posts: 301
Joined: Tue Jun 08, 2010 8:13 pm

#16 Postby Mylon » Wed Oct 03, 2012 1:58 pm

I like to lump the damage results as a hit location effect.

Just landed a 26 damage hit? That was actually a headshot and it hit so hard because it bypassed armor and got +4.

Kodyax
Veteran
Posts: 500
Joined: Wed Sep 29, 2010 12:59 am

#17 Postby Kodyax » Wed Oct 03, 2012 4:03 pm

I'n hearing a lot of good arguments. Although I may have to look for the dice. Something to roll can add to the drama of the narrative.

User avatar
Yuri
Veteran
Posts: 628
Joined: Tue May 13, 2003 1:44 pm
Location: Queensbury NY

#18 Postby Yuri » Wed Oct 03, 2012 7:09 pm

We used that the Hit Location die about a month ago in our Deadlands Game.

Once of the players was a Harrowed Mad Scientist, and his second gadget blew up and took his to the Incapacitated Table. As a lark, I said "hey, let's see where that damage occurred"

He rolls, and it comes up Head Shot!!! He laughed... his character did die that evening! The player thought it was all very reasonable and added to the game.

Y
I think we're property - Charles Fort

The Dread Polack
Veteran
Posts: 555
Age: 36
Joined: Wed Mar 02, 2011 11:48 pm
Location: Minneapolis, MN

#19 Postby The Dread Polack » Thu Oct 04, 2012 11:17 am

Mylon wrote:I like to lump the damage results as a hit location effect.

Just landed a 26 damage hit? That was actually a headshot and it hit so hard because it bypassed armor and got +4.


Me too. It seems like every time I've tried using hit locations, I end up doing massive damage to the left foot, or something that just doesn't make sense. It just seems to me to be easier to determind damage normally, and any side-effects from it, and explain how it got that way.

User avatar
Maine
Seasoned
Posts: 124
Joined: Thu Jan 01, 2009 5:41 pm

#20 Postby Maine » Wed Oct 10, 2012 6:20 pm

Isn't this already covered by one of the damage variants in Deluxe, which suggests to roll on the Incapacitation chart whenever a Wound is sustained?

Outside of AoE effects (which are pretty indiscriminate, and unlikely that only a single body party is going to be affected), this matters most for aimed attacks.

If you are taking a shot at something, you are aiming at something on that target - either a called shot (and we have our location then) or center of mass (torso). The likelihood of hitting limbs is still present, but the chance of hitting hands/feet is much, much smaller unless they are intervening. The position of the target matters.

Finally, remember that most of the Injuries can be some heft penalties on top of the Wounds...


Return to “SW Home-brew Settings & Conversions”

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 0 guests