[Talisman Studios] The Trouble With Brinchie

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Should I Change the Brinchie Racial Advantage, Dexterous?

Yes, it should only apply to Agility. Agility-based Skills should not benefit.
9
14%
Yes, it should only apply to Agility. Agility-based Skills should not benefit.
9
14%
Yes, it should only apply to Agility. Agility-based Skills should not benefit.
9
14%
Yes, it should only apply to Agility. Agility-based Skills should not benefit.
9
14%
No, leave it alone. It's not that bad, and it's fairly balanced overall.
3
5%
No, leave it alone. It's not that bad, and it's fairly balanced overall.
3
5%
No, leave it alone. It's not that bad, and it's fairly balanced overall.
3
5%
No, leave it alone. It's not that bad, and it's fairly balanced overall.
3
5%
Yes, you should change it, but I have an alternate idea (explained below).
4
6%
Yes, you should change it, but I have an alternate idea (explained below).
4
6%
Yes, you should change it, but I have an alternate idea (explained below).
4
6%
Yes, you should change it, but I have an alternate idea (explained below).
4
6%
 
Total votes: 64

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Sean Patrick Fannon
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[Talisman Studios] The Trouble With Brinchie

#1 Postby Sean Patrick Fannon » Tue Jan 24, 2006 11:32 pm

In the Shaintar Player's Guide, the Brinchie have a very powerful advantage that reads, pretty much, as follows:

· Dexterous: Brinchie are incredibly nimble and quick on their feet, beginning with a d6 Agility. Furthermore, their natural maximum Agility is d12+2, and they can reach this with normal Level Ups without applying the Professional, Expert, or Master Legendary Edges (which can bump their Agility to d12+3 and +4, respectively). This advantage extends to any Agility-based skills they have, as well, though the natural Agility must be raised to these levels before the skills can go that high

I italicized that last part for emphasis, because that's where the trouble lies. I have been fairly convinced that, despite the massive "cost break," so few players would ever be able or willing to exploit this that it didn't seem that bad.

I am finally starting to think that it is, in fact, a bad idea.

Hence the poll. Your thoughts are welcome. If you help convince me to change this, I will likely have a corrected version in the final Shaintar setting book.
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#2 Postby starwars1138 » Wed Jan 25, 2006 2:34 am

I'd leave your original "vision" as it is, but perhaps add an optional houserule for those who think it would be a problem. That way you are off the hook as it were, if someone trys to exploit it.
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Re: [Talisman Studios] The Trouble With Brinchie

#3 Postby ragnarok » Wed Jan 25, 2006 8:41 am

Sean Patrick Fannon wrote:This advantage extends to any Agility-based skills they have, as well, though the natural Agility must be raised to these levels before the skills can go that high
This is indeed quite a bit powerful. What about, making it possible to raise these skills up to the agilty without the edges, but pay for each point with a single advancement(like buying a skill over you attribute).

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#4 Postby Seeker Jon » Wed Jan 25, 2006 8:42 am

Many of the people I know, but usually avoid playing with, are munchkins, unfortuneately, and I can see that being easily exploited by them. I'd make it just the flat starting d6 in Agility.

Thinking abut it now, maybe give Brinchie a bonus to all Agility skill rolls instead of what you currently have?

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#5 Postby Clint » Wed Jan 25, 2006 9:51 am

Just to clarify, all the races in Shaintar have that ability if their Attributes go above a d12 racially. The Brinchie are just the only ones that it has a major effect on, being Agility as opposed to Strength or Vigor.

That said, I'd drop it. Hmm, in fact, I might drop the whole Agility higher than a d12 and go a different route based on the description of the Brinchie, focusing on the speed aspects more than Agility.


Dexterous: Brinchie are nimble and quick on their feet, beginning with a d6 Agility. In addition, they gain a +2 bonus to Notice for surprise purposes due to their fast reactions.


I like this on one hand because it "fixes" a reactionary weakness of the Brinchie (Notice would be an expensive skill for them). And on the other hand, the higher Agility maximum is somewhat redundant. They already get the Acrobat Edge, giving them a +2 bonus to Agility rolls which I think covers them perfectly.

Normally, I don't know if it would be a big deal, but Shaintar is perfect for characters to go beyond Legendary. The gap between the Brinchie and other races is just going to widen with experience.

Still, just my two cents.
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#6 Postby Bill » Wed Jan 25, 2006 9:52 am

If you envision the most dexterous Brinchie to be better than any other race all you need is:

· Dexterous: Brinchie are incredibly nimble and quick on their feet, beginning with a d6 Agility. Furthermore, their natural maximum Agility is d12+2, and they can reach this with normal Level Ups without applying the Professional, Expert, or Master Legendary Edges (which can bump their Agility to d12+3 and +4, respectively).

If you envision the Brinchie to be more graceful than any other race (but not neccessarily more dexterous) than;

.Graceful: Brinchie are incredibly nimble and graceful in all they do. They add +2 on all Agility tests and agility based skills.

If you envision that only the most dedicated Brinchie could excell over all other races than use the first for the base creation but allow skills that are agility based to be raised up to the bonus level on a one advance per +1 basis. This could be unballancing at the high end due to Fighting and Shooting both being agility based and Parry tying into fighting. Are Brinchie the best potential fighters and archers in Shaintar?
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#7 Postby Clint » Wed Jan 25, 2006 10:27 am

Bill wrote:Graceful: Brinchie are incredibly nimble and graceful in all they do. They add +2 on all Agility tests and agility based skills.


:1eek:

Might be a bit much. I think I'd rank that as about a 30 point racial ability.
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#8 Postby DerFinsterling » Wed Jan 25, 2006 10:45 am

Bill wrote:.Graceful: Brinchie are incredibly nimble and graceful in all they do. They add +2 on all Agility tests and agility based skills.


:o Dude, that amounts to +2 to Fighting, Throwing, Shooting... making Brinchies the Ultimate Overpowered Warriors! Capital u, capital o, capital w!

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#9 Postby Bill » Fri Jan 27, 2006 1:53 pm

Clint wrote:
Bill wrote:Graceful: Brinchie are incredibly nimble and graceful in all they do. They add +2 on all Agility tests and agility based skills.


:1eek:

Might be a bit much. I think I'd rank that as about a 30 point racial ability.


True! I stand abashed.

Sad part is I have two players to whom I could allow this ability and they would still fail on every critical check 50% of the time. It is not that they "beat" the odds with an outlandish number of ones, but when it counts for something they will roll a critical failure with any kind of dice you want to hand them :o
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#10 Postby Ben Rogers » Fri Jan 27, 2006 5:16 pm

Bill wrote:Sad part is I have two players to whom I could allow this ability and they would still fail on every critical check 50% of the time. It is not that they "beat" the odds with an outlandish number of ones, but when it counts for something they will roll a critical failure with any kind of dice you want to hand them :o


Never. Ever. Ever. EVER! Allow them to throw grenades or bottle-rockets. EVER! :o
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#11 Postby ElectronicParke » Fri Feb 03, 2006 10:56 am

Simple idea: change "This advantage extends to any Agility-based skills they have..." to "This advantage extends to one Agility-based skill they have..."

I'd even reword it as a seperate advantage: Call it a signature skill or something like that. It would be one agility-based skill they could raise above d12, as long as Agility has been raised that high.

I think it balances it and makes a fun choice for the player. They get to say "My character is going to be well-known for his Throwing ability" or such.
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